@Erica: Loved the quote from Kierkegaard.

Extending on Glover's point, not only are we in a good position compared to other law students, we are also lucky to even have the ability to pursue a grander goal beyond the concerns of day-to-day living and survival (although our student loans provide a persuasive counter-argument). It's a little disappointing to feel like we're being herded into the big firm job. Paying back loans and pursuing riches definitely seems like the default course here, so that we can reach a point where we've 'bought back' our freedom. In the end though, the anxiety of that freedom persists. Calming the first of the two fears described by Nathan at the beginning of the discussion is only a way of deferring the real decision. I really would like to believe Professor Moglen's pitch that it doesn't have to be a choice between firm job or economic bondage/loss of freedom. It will take some knowledge, creativity and time to figure that out.

-- JeffKao - 06 Feb 2010

I am quite anxious after reading all of this. What is bothering the most, I think, is Nathan's memory of sitting in the library and just going on an adventure. I used to do that all the time. I do absolutely none of that now. When I think I have the time to, I end up saying to myself - why now join an extracurricular? In which you probably just listen to panels (although I'm sure a lot of them are interesting) and socializing with like-minded people who might just want to have the extracurricular on their resume. I rarely find myself going above and beyond intellectually...I remember as an undergraduate something would catch my eye when reading and I'd mark it down and then spend the next day or two just researching it or figuring it out in my head. Having grades unequivocally reduces my desire to do that...and even creates cognitive dissonance about it because I don't think any employer is really going to care that I'm intellectually curious or "take initiative" when all they say is "Please update your application with your 1L grades" --- and then wait for them to say nothing. This is of course a means/ends problem...but my sense of urgency with this 1L summer job thing is really clouding my mind and perhaps deluding me.

-- JessicaCohen - 05 Feb 2010

I've got to admit that I'm with Cecilia on this one. Forgive the platitudes, but we're at one of the most well respected law schools in America, at one of the more well-respected universities in the world -- one of the few universities, indeed, that has truly global recognition. We've all done different things in life, and apparently we've made it this far without managing to screw up too terribly. If we were going to totally fail, we probably already would have. As it is, we're still extraordinarily lucky to be where we are, students in a culture designed to reward the people who have somehow found their way to the upper echelon of the legal academy that we inhabit today. We have quite a bit of inertia, and I think that it will take more than a recession to bring us totally to a halt -- through no particular merits of our own. So we shouldn't take our current trajectory lightly, but we should at least allow it to temper our anxiety, which should be focused not on whether we will have jobs but instead on what those jobs might be.

That said, Eben, debt financing of law school is truly horrible, and I wonder what you think might someday be done to mitigate its effects on legal education and on the profession.

-- GloverWright - 04 Feb 2010

The above reads a lot more naively than I'd like, but in the interest of discussion I'll let it stand. My main point, though, is that unlike the majority of law students in America right now, we're in a pretty strong position, and we shouldn't lose sight of that fact. Moreover, we're studying in a place that can enable us to work anywhere in the the country -- and indeed the world -- that we would like to go, including a lot of places where grades might not matter so much. And relative to most people in this country, the deck is still stacked pretty much in our favor.

And one more thing, probably the most important: as Eben as suggested, there will always be work for people who are are very good at what they do. The trick lies in finding what that particular thing is, and generally speaking I don't think that finding it is something that can be forced. It may take time, but it occurs naturally. And I don't think that anxiety about finding it is particularly helpful -- in fact it's probably the opposite.

-- GloverWright - 04 Feb 2010

@Nathan

I really like your faucet analogy regarding the semester. Interestingly, I felt the same way about finals. It was the first time that I could take a step back and try to make sense out of what I was learning. I actually found it less stressful than I did much of the semester, as strange as it seems. The first 12-13 weeks of the semester I spent scrambling to stay on top of my reading, to make sure I grasped every concept brought up in class and in general worrying about whether I was falling behind and "not getting things". During finals, for the first time, this weight was lifted off my shoulders. I was able to work at my own pace, put things together and not worry about whether I was doing as well as the person sitting next to me.

My favorite part, however, was that the two classes that I found most boring suddenly became interesting. Because of all my worrying and the frenetic pace during the semester, I never had a chance to step back and try to put together what I was learning. Isolated rules and concepts are generally uninteresting, but when one constructs a comprehensive framework in his/her mind and considers the reasons that it exists and the implications of it, subjects become much more interesting. It was the first (and only) time thus far that I truly enjoyed law school, as strange as it may seem. Everyone told me I’d hate finals – in fact, I really enjoyed them. I wish Columbia would give us more opportunities to do this. I strongly believe that it would assist students in developing true interests, and when students have true interests in subjects, they are much more likely to try and turn these into career options than simply pawning their licenses.

@Caroline

I did work inside one of the types of firms that Ron posted for 2 years (as a legal assistant). My average workweek was ~77 hours, and this includes only billable time, not time spent inside the building. The view from inside is "sexy" and I think this is how the firms are so successful at getting people to stay. It was plush; we got all the free food we could eat; we were constantly told how spectacular we were. In effect, we were told that we were "enjoying life" because we had the opportunity to spend a Saturday night in the office, working on a due diligence project for a merger that likely wouldn't happen, while wearing expensive shirts and having our overpriced apartments cleaned by someone else. Looking back at my experience, the firm was successful in that I actually believed that I was enjoying life during my experience. I think that one of the big problems with the way the school operates is that it does nothing to suggest to students or demonstrate to students that there are other ways to "enjoy life", and that one of these is through a job that is intellectually satisfying and allows you to work on a cause you really believe about.

-- DavidGoldin - 04 Feb 2010